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Buy the Numbers

Buy the Numbers

By: Mike Payne
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A deep dive into the financials of running a Manufacturing business.2024 Economics Management Management & Leadership
Episodes
  • Women, Purpose, and Pay: The Honest Conversation Manufacturing Needs to Have, Ep #48

    Women, Purpose, and Pay: The Honest Conversation Manufacturing Needs to Have, Ep #48
    Jun 11 2026
    Part two of a good conversation is where things usually get real. In this episode, I pick back up with Nush Ahmed and Brooke Laing from Sisterhood of Trades, and we get into the questions most shop owners quietly wonder about but rarely say out loud: why more women aren't walking through the door, what it actually looks like to attract them, and whether our instinct to "just hire good people" is actually enough. One of the things that struck me in this conversation is how simple some of the answers are. Women aren't applying to manufacturing jobs in large numbers not because they don't want to work in a shop, but because many of them have no idea what manufacturing even is as a career option. Visibility is the entry point. And social media, whether you're comfortable with TikTok or not, is where that visibility happens today. If your shop isn't showing up where the next generation is spending time, you're not even in the conversation. We also got real about what the next generation is actually looking for, and it's more nuanced than just higher wages. Purpose matters. Acknowledgment matters. The small things, a "good job" at the end of a shift, a manager who notices when someone puts in extra effort, carry more weight than I expected. That said, we had an honest conversation about total compensation, and I think every business owner who has ever been frustrated by someone turning down a job offer because the hourly rate was a dollar short will find something useful in where that conversation went. We also touched on transparency, specifically what happens when shop owners start being honest with their teams about the economics of running a business. The response is usually not what you'd expect. Most people, when they actually understand the numbers, become more invested, not less. That's a management insight worth sitting with. This is one of those episodes where I walked away having learned something. And when that happens, I like to share it. You will want to hear this episode if you are interested in… (0:00) Welcome back and kicking off Part 2 with Nush and Brooke from Sisterhood of Trades(1:35) Why the next generation values purpose as much as a paycheck (and what that means for hiring)(4:55) How showing up at industry events creates real connections across generations(6:24) Your buyers have technical questions. Navu delivers reliable, accurate answers. Learn more at Navu.co/MakingChips (7:35) The visibility problem: women don't enter manufacturing because most don't know it's an option(10:10) Why your shop's social media presence is a recruiting tool whether you use it that way or not(13:07) Show women doing the real work: why representation on social media drives applications(17:42) Take your shop to the next level with DN Solutions(18:57) The positive reinforcement gap and why a simple "good job" can keep someone in the trades(20:54) Can you give hard feedback if you're not giving positive feedback first?(23:33) Why clean bathrooms are a better judge of company culture than most shop owners realize(24:58) Why we love the quality of SMW Autoblok workholding(25:45) Healthcare benefits and why total compensation matters more than the number on an offer letter(33:59) Why being transparent about shop economics helps workers understand what owners are dealing with(37:46) Closing the generational gap: what both sides actually need to do to connect(42:37) How to find Sisterhood of Trades and connect with Nush and Brooke Resources Mentioned Your buyers have technical questions. Navu delivers reliable, accurate answers. Learn more at Navu.co/MakingChips Take your shop to the next level with DN SolutionsWhy we love the quality of SMW Autoblok workholding Connect with Our Guests Nush Ahmed on LinkedInBrooke Laing on LinkedInSisterhood of Trades on TikTok Connect with Buy the Numbers Follow on LinkedInConnect with Mike Payne on LinkedIn Subscribe to Buy the Numbers on Apple + Spotify
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    44 mins
  • No Cap: Manufacturing's Generational Communication Breakdown, Ep #47

    No Cap: Manufacturing's Generational Communication Breakdown, Ep #47
    May 28 2026
    In this episode of Buy the Numbers, I sat down with Nush Ahmed and Brooke Laing for one of the more entertaining and eye-opening conversations I've had in a while. What started with jokes about generational slang and communication styles quickly turned into a serious discussion about leadership, workplace culture, and what younger generations are actually looking for in manufacturing careers. As someone who's spent decades building teams and leading manufacturing companies, I've seen firsthand how much the workforce has changed. Today, many companies have four or even five generations working side by side, each with different expectations around communication, feedback, work-life balance, and career growth. This episode dives into those differences head-on, from the "no news is good news" mentality many older generations grew up with to the constant feedback and transparency younger workers expect today. We also talked about something I think manufacturing leaders need to hear more often: younger employees want opportunity and involvement, not just a paycheck. Nush and Brooke shared stories about trade shows, networking, community-building, and why companies often miss the mark when they fail to support employees who are trying to grow professionally. Hearing how impactful events like IMTS and industry networking were to their careers reinforced something I strongly believe: if someone on your team wants to learn, connect, and represent your company, you should encourage it. This conversation challenged some of my own assumptions and reinforced others, but more than anything, it highlighted how important communication and intentional leadership are if we want to attract and retain the next generation in manufacturing. Whether you're a shop owner, manager, or someone entering the trades yourself, there's a lot in this episode that will probably sound familiar. And yes, there are still plenty of dad jokes and generational roasts mixed in along the way. You will want to hear this episode if you are interested in... (0:00) Mike reflects on the chaotic and hilarious Toolpath Summit recording session(2:25) Nush and Brooke introduce their backgrounds in trades, manufacturing, and Sisterhood of Trades(4:08) Navigating multiple generations in today's manufacturing workforce(6:33) Breaking down Gen Z slang, communication styles, and workplace language gaps(12:02) How generational communication differences affect management and feedback(16:16) Get a free report of sales opportunities in your area from FacturMFG.com/chips(17:25) Mike shares how Hill Manufacturing intentionally built a younger leadership team(19:56) Why younger workers often feel disconnected from ownership and management(24:35) Red flags Gen Z notices immediately when evaluating employers(26:45) Why older generations often equate long hours with commitment and value(29:46) Gen Z perspectives on work-life balance, proving yourself, and career growth(32:23) Grow your top and bottom line with CliftonLarsonAllen (CLA)(33:34) The debate around "family culture" in manufacturing companies(36:55) What younger workers actually value most from leadership and workplace culture(38:21) Trying to finance your equipment? Check out Verdantcc.com/numbers(38:54) The role of pay, flexibility, and opportunity in attracting younger talent(40:11) Why employers should support younger workers attending trade shows and industry events(43:10) Brooke shares her experience being laid off after taking time off for industry involvement(44:03) Stay tuned for part two: A conversation around women in manufacturing and social visibility Resources & People Mentioned Get a free report of sales opportunities in your area from FacturMFG.com/chipsGrow your top and bottom line with CliftonLarsonAllen (CLA)Trying to finance your equipment? Check out Verdantcc.com/numbers Connect with the Sisterhood of Trades Sisterhood of TradesNush Ahmed on LinkedInBrooke Laing on LinkedInSisterhood of Trades on LinkedInSisterhood of Trades on InstagramSisterhood of Trades on TikTok Connect With Buy the Numbers Follow on LinkedInConnect with Mike Payne on LinkedIn Subscribe to Buy the Numbers on Apple + Spotify Audio Production and Show Notes by - PODCAST FAST TRACK
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    45 mins
  • The Real ROI of Automation: CapEx, Capacity & the Cost of Doing Nothing, Ep #46

    The Real ROI of Automation: CapEx, Capacity & the Cost of Doing Nothing, Ep #46
    May 14 2026
    Recorded live from the DN Solutions open house near Chicago, this special crossover episode blends the worlds of Buy the Numbers and Lights Out into one conversation about manufacturing growth, automation, and the real numbers behind machine tool investments. Surrounded by machines making chips all around us, we dive into what actually drives smart capital expenditures in a modern machine shop. Throughout the episode, we unpack the balancing act between financial discipline and strategic growth. From twin-spindle turning centers to automated five-axis workflows, we discuss how manufacturers should think about throughput, spindle utilization, labor constraints, machine consolidation, and long-term capacity planning. More importantly, we explore how shops can avoid the trap of simply buying equipment because it looks exciting instead of because it solves a real operational need. We also pull back the curtain on how Hill Manufacturing evaluates new opportunities and plans for future growth. Mike walks through a real-world example of assessing a major customer opportunity that could dramatically increase revenue, while simultaneously forcing hard decisions around automation, throughput targets, and production capacity. The result becomes a practical conversation about how manufacturers should approach ROI calculations, CapEx strategy, and investing in capability before they absolutely need it. Along the way, we tackle one of the biggest misconceptions around automation: that it's about replacing people. In reality, we believe automation is about freeing skilled employees from repetitive, low-value tasks so they can focus on setups, process improvement, and higher-level problem solving. Whether it's unattended machining, machine monitoring, or smarter workflows, this episode is ultimately about building manufacturing businesses that run more efficiently, scale more intelligently, and create more freedom for the people inside them. You will want to hear this episode if you are interested in... (0:00) A special live crossover episode from the DN Solutions open house blends "Buy the Numbers" and "Lights Out"(2:15) Mike and Nick discuss the future "roadshow" concept and why tech centers may be the future of manufacturing events(4:09) Mike explains how he approaches multi-year CapEx planning and evaluating future machine investments(9:10) Why every machine shop should have a formal capital expenditure strategy(11:24) Why we love Verdant Commercial Capital for equipment financing(11:57) How maximizing older equipment and improving workflows can delay unnecessary machine purchases(16:50) How automation, machine monitoring, and tool optimization work together to increase utilization(18:30) Why the numbers matter in manufacturing decisions, even when strategic choices go beyond pure ROI(21:56) The parallels between buying machine tools and acquiring manufacturing businesses(24:43) The rapid pace of innovation in manufacturing software, automation, and shop-floor technology(27:43) The true cost of downtime, DIY fixes, and underestimating the value of people's time(31:10) Why automation is really about freeing skilled employees to do higher-value work(33:30) Get a free report of sales opportunities in your area from FacturMFG.com/chips(35:15) Mike walks through evaluating a major new customer opportunity and determining required capacity(40:24) Grow your top and bottom line with CliftonLarsonAllen (CLA)(41:04) How ROI calculators and throughput modeling help justify major equipment investments(45:37) Why service support and machine uptime are critical factors in choosing machine tool partners(47:16) How automation improves profitability without forcing shops to lower pricing(49:22) Why profitability is essential for taking care of employees, customers, and the broader community Resources & People Mentioned Why we love Verdant Commercial Capital for equipment financingHennig ROI CalculatorGrow your top and bottom line with CliftonLarsonAllen (CLA)Get a free report of sales opportunities in your area from FacturMFG.com/chips Connect With Buy the Numbers Follow on LinkedInConnect with Mike Payne on LinkedIn Subscribe to Buy the Numbers on Apple + Spotify Audio Production and Show Notes by - PODCAST FAST TRACK
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    53 mins
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